Or when a person goes down with a serious disease, and it makes them look different and they find their new appearance horrifying and don't know what to do about it. I've had a period when I had a lot of such clients, literally crowds, of this kind - the recovering, the sick, the dying, the ones who recovered despite being ready to die. And I'm extremely good at it, in fact - I really love this kind of work. Look, I'm rubbing my ear now - what is that about? Maybe, I'm a bit scared, because it's very energy-consuming and I have to look for the right words. But it was terribly interesting and very productive indeed. So it's for those who can't stand how they look, how their appearance has changed, as well as for those who may be ok with themselves, but just feel that what they have inside doesn't meet how they look on the outside and get lost trying to make it match. Or, like I had it the last time… Don't worry, I remember the question. So a girl came to me and I offered her a refund straight away, because from what she told about herself and from what I actually saw I realized that I had such things to tell her that one is just not supposed to tell anyone, unless they're a psychotherapist who would then fix all that my words would destroy in her life. Still, she insisted. But I've managed to find the words, I've found a way to make it match, I've told her what, to my eye, should look totally different, and that surely wasn't sounding like a compliment, and yet I've told her all of that. So I am aware of the fact that I can be not so good for people. Not good at all.

- Could you speculate a bit more on the problem itself? Maybe more specifically: how such a mismatch can manifest itself, what is this mismatch at all? Just let's leave aside for now the extreme and exotic cases, such as recovery after a terminal disease, and tell me more about more ordinary ones, so our audience could recognize themselves, you know. So, how is it usually manifested?

- Maybe it's manifested in… So imagine someone writing a text about themselves: it can be just a couple of lines or a huge poem, but there's an inescapable shade of sadness all over it, like everything just seems wrong and it's hard to tell what exactly…

- You mean the clothes, right?

- No, it can be anything from relationships with spouses, problems at work, some kind of exhaustion or burnout. Or fear, when they feel they need a change, need to move or find a new job, but have no energy to actually do the thing. So usually they come to me with pretty much the same issues as to a psychotherapist. And here my acquaintance with Roitman really helps. Our 18 years of communication and all his marathons I've been to. This right now may scare some people off, by the way. That would be a good thing, in fact. So, same as Roitman, I believe that one should come to me only when they feel like they're on the edge and ready, to quote him, to change all for all. Only when you're ready to change absolutely everything, that's the only time to come to me. Otherwise it just won't help.

- Well, that's a very important criterion you haven't mentioned yet. That a person has to be on the edge and in need of some radical solutions. So this is the indication for them to go to you?

- You know, it's maybe the mistake of all who've been in their business for too long - we start believing that everyone already knows by default, but that's, of course, wrong. But this conduct of mine and my reputation on the internet is maybe my mercy to the world - to make sure that the people for whom my work could turn out doing more harm than good stay away from me. So for those that I push away - it's only for their best. Because yes, I'm about changing all for all. Really, change all for… I don't know. But those who do reach me must also be healthy to be able handle all these radical changes, and not go like AAAAARGH. So evaluate the situation reasonably and accept what you're going to pay and for what.

- So one is also expected to miraculously have the inner resources to handle all that?

- Yes. So, hanging on the edge, and at the same time… So that's why I am for quite a narrow audience. Because usually they either have already crashed to the bottom completely, or…

- But there are such people, right? I mean you have the cases when someone comes and you see that this is exactly what was supposed to happen, it's a great case, it's your client.

- True.

- So they actually do exist.

- They're just much fewer now than, say… In the past half a year their number has dropped. As well as two years ago. So, two years ago the number dropped, and half a year back it dropped even lower.

- But it doesn't mean there are fewer of them in nature? You've just become less visible to them.

- Less visible, yes, and priorities change. People now think that this can't be put as a priority. Though the ones who had come to me, realize it totally can and should, because it gives them new energy, a reconsideration, reevaluation of priorities and the new powers - acknowledging oneself as someone new does give a lot of fresh energy to deal with the new circumstances.

- Ok, so let's return to our theme. We were talking about the problem. That the problem, like you say, doesn't sound like "I have nothing to wear", but it has a specific symptom - something like "everything is wrong", or how did you just put it?

- Yes, when everything in one's life is wrong. Anywhere you dig, it's all wrong.

- All wrong, yes. So there can be many symptoms, right? Wrong in a relationship, wrong at work, wrong about how they look…

- Here, there or everywhere at the same time.

- Yes, yes, yes. So how can you describe this "wrong"? What kind of "wrong" is it?

- It's always some part of us that we suppress. Most often they suppress either the Outlaw or the Jester, or, most frequently, the Ruler. When one has long been an adult, competent and experienced, but still wants to be a sweetie, because that's what we've been taught: don't stand out, don't think you're better than anyone else, don't act like you need more than others - all of that. And one thinks that if he/she… even without acknowledging the Ruler in them, if they just demonstrate these qualities it would make people around pull away even more. So they start wearing stuff like that lady from Harry Potter, what's her name, the one forever in pink suits, kind of like a nice and good lady - but you look at her and you're terrified, and it's clear that if she just took off those pink suits she'd be quite alright, yes, a bitch, but she's sorting out some stuff out there - I mean people are able to accept nearly everything, provided you're not trying to cheat them.

So I can say to someone: look, let's lift that collar up like that and see how different it is already - and it's not a mean biddy in wrinkled rags anymore - it's a serious expert that has to maintain the hierarchy somehow. And so she warns: don't come close to me - and that's it. And the distinguished audience steps aside, and with great pleasure, by the way, because all… It seems to me all people love the Rulers, the real and manifested ones, because a Rules means your calm, they're a guarantee that someone will make sure that everyone has things to do, and everything operates properly and in line with the plan, while you can relax being an Everyman, or whatever.

So go ahead, manifest yourselves, I say - and people quickly come to peace with that. The happiest clients of mine, I guess, are those who carried this Ruler in them trying to find a way to show thought and finally got permission to walk on the red carpet, and, just generally, grant themselves permission.

- Ok. So this was very well put just now, that there is a suppressed part and it contains a resource, and one can discover it and let it bloom and manifest itself - and things will change then, right?
And now the main question. So all this work of yours, all that you do - how exactly do you help people with their issues? How does it happen, that the change occurs due to your help, or what do you call it?

- An initiation. I guess that's what it is. I'm thinking now how I could tell about it avoiding the Human Design terminology that many either don't know or reject, but nevertheless, the answer is there. And maybe also in a research on myself that we once did together with Valentina Gabysheva, and it turned out that my concealed archetype, not showing itself in any way in my exterior and totally suppressed by "Mom said this, Mom said that" - is actually that of the Lover. So if I do agree to work with someone, in that very moment I love that person inside out - like, for real, giving all of my carcass to it. Bad word. My tailor scolds me for saying so, but it's just flinged off somehow. So I give all of myself to that, and my voice possesses some kind of, I don't know, energies, vibes, and people nearly always talk in their feedbacks about my voice, about how it sounds and how that affects them. So I influence with my voice, and when I'm telling someone about them with loads of love, seeing in them the very best they've long ago fucked up in this life, or forgot, or didn't even know, and so I find it and bring it to light - and people cry a lot. I just trust the feedbacks here, but in our joint work with Gabysheva we see it live - when you hit a certain place inside a person and - there it is. I believe that's how it works. I initiate by my attitude toward someone expressed in the sound of my voice.

- And what is going on inside you? I mean, what are you actually doing while looking at the pictures and reading the text?

- Oh it's always a fountain of the most diverse emotions. Very often the first thing I feel is strong disaffection, because I look at the pictures and I see it's all wasted, all wrong, everything that possibly can be, and it doesn't match. Like when I look at my own pictures from different years, I feel the same - I mean, who the hell is it? Who is that tumbling poor thing? And imagine that feeling when people hate each other - and so I become this someone who hates. I look and think: what is this unintelligibility? And the unintelligible is always frightening. And whatever's frightening you always somehow… Well, you hate it. And so I voice it. And then I read the text…

- Voice it, like, send a voice message?

- Right.

- Cool.

- How'd I do it otherwise? And… It's a recent thing, not everyone has had the luck. I say the luck, because where else would you learn what it actually looks like, for real? No one says that in your face. On request and for big money only. And so then I read the text and… The whole range of emotions, I mean what I feel is always a burst of emotions of all kinds. So when I read the text it can be like: "Gosh, how could I have thought this and that. Of course he/she was like this, and I go and think of them like such a bitch… And I record another voice message explaining that I've realized something. Or I may think: oh my god, so she writes this and looks like that - and she wants to… So, a full range of absolutely human emotions. Sometimes I may think that the person is unfortunate, or mean, or whatever. But again, like Roitman said, in the final feedback all claims disappear. So that voice message I record later in the course of work, it accounts for all the previous notes, but digested into… Lilya Kim said about that: if an artist just shows darkness in a talented way without letting it through her/his system first, he/she just multiplies the darkness in the world. So this creative spark, or what she calls it - I've been repeating this over and over again, and eventually forgot - "the spark of joyful creativity", I think. That means letting it thought your own system, so that after this digestive process, after all those terrible and, I don't know, deceitful - yes, most of the times deceitful - pictures, and that text that's either full of self-scourging or the "I-am-so-totally-amazing" kind of vibe - having digested my emotions about all of that, about this person being such a fool, or a liar, or whatever - only once it's all digested, am I able to give the feedback with much love - and that's when it starts working.

- So a person brings all of these issues to you. In any case they have to put their effort into it. For some of them 120 euros is not such big money and they can treat the process less seriously - just drop a few lines of text, send something, but anyway they put a certain amount of real effort and willingness into it. And so it turns out that the job is actually done by the clients themselves.

- From the beginning to the end.

- Yes, so you just give them certain stimuli for this in your audios.

- Well, my emotions, I believe.

- Right, but the two have to meet: their inquiry and your work. What I mean is, what if you could precisely calibrate that incoming flow, to make sure only those reach you who are really ready, who have this problem that you're curious to work with, and to help with, and who have the inner resource for that work, then you will be getting 100% results in fact.

- You know, like you said in the beginning, that if one wants to become visible one way or another, no matter what he/she thinks of it, they have to rename their formats and show themselves, so it's really like starting all over again. And you said about a 100% result and I recalled the same question from my darling Alla Immanuilovna, who would ask: what kind of a back-shot do you want? As Roitman claims, out of 10 people that come to a marathon, one will get a miracle, two will start doing something in the process, a few more will have delayed results, and there will always be one that saw it all happen to the others, but her/himself will get nothing - and that it's normal, it always happens this way. And I thought to myself: so how much do I want, and then it was born - I even have it now as a hashtag - #12outof10. And actually not just 12, I want, I don't know, 120 out of 10. So that one person would come to me and then spread the circles on the water. So that the people around her/him would look and notice that something has happened. One of the first girls that came to me in Karmiel said: just let's keep it secret from my husband, let's meet when he's not around, because he will get mad - such money (at the time it wasn't such big money, in fact, but it was for her at the time). And so in a week she writes to me: I had to tell my husband, because he started asking: what happened? Why are you like that? And so she told him. I can't say her name, but, firstly, I think she'll recognize herself if she'll be listening to the interview, and second, now she is… I mean, no more working as a checkout cashier, her life is all wow now. Totally wow. And it pleases me to think that I have played a hand in that and… I've lost the trail of thought again.

- You want 120 out of 10, you were saying. About the results.

- Right, that the people around start to see and ask what's happened. And that a person can even… By the way, that girl is working with people around too, she does more or less the same thing as I do, but in a different field.

- And by the way, what would you call it? What kind of change do you want? So by means of these 120 out of 10 something is happening in the world, right? What do you want to be happening?

- Oh well, I want it to be beautiful. You see, everyone, when they're at peace with themselves, and the people around detect this inner peace that is not fake, but actually there ARE people that have it… Why do they love negative characters no matter what? Because they're true to themselves in their negativity, they don't hide it, they bathe in it, they're very sincere in it with both themselves and the others. And the others think: ok, so he/she is a fucker, but what a cool fucker. Why the most monstrous motherfuckers like fascists, Nazis and whoever, live to the very old age in good health? Because he was born a piece of shit and died a piece of shit with no regrets - he just never got caught. While the good, kind-hearted people - they gain weight, they fall sick, they die early - because they've been pretending all their lives. So let's stop pretending. I don't know what to do about the fascists. I recall Roitman's words again, he said: "When they ask me in the interviews if I would take on Hitler"... He would think for a while and then say he would. I also get these ambitious thoughts at times - what if I would manage to find something in there? Had they accepted him at that arts' school, maybe none of that horror would have happened. So all about his lack of love it was. So if any of you think that I don't love them enough - come on over, I'll do my best to love you enough.